cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/36603369
Italy is sending a ship to accompany the Gaza-bound Global Sumud Flotilla, who said its activists remain shaken but determined following an Israeli attack on Wednesday morning.
Organisers of expedition, which is attempting to carry aid to the Gaza Strip, shared footage this morning appears to show an explosion that detonated on one of the flotilla’s vessels.
Late on Tuesday activists heard explosions and saw drones that targeted some of their boats, currently situated off Greece. “Multiple drones, unidentified objects dropped, communications jammed and explosions heard from a number of boats,” the Global Sumud Flotilla said.
“I have authorised the immediate intervention of the Navy’s frigate Fasan, which was sailing north of Crete and is heading towards the area,” Italian Defence Minister Guido Crosetto said in a statement.
It’s been interesting to see the general hexbear take on China develop more towards the way I view the PRC. I used to feel way out on a limb not being a terminally online Dengist, and it felt like any criticism no matter how constructive was shouted down in favour of a vulgar uncritical support (and leaning on the “perpetual cope”, great turn of phrase btw).
Personally I am happy to see this development in the political judgment of the user base.
Well I think it’s a bit of an overcorrection from other western leftist spaces where there are lots of chauvinists who say China has no socialist characteristics whatsoever and is an evil authoritarian capitalist tankie country. Those people are equally annoying and without nuance or investigation.
I think the problem here is just bandwagoning onto a side without proper investigation and research into what China is actually like. It’s neither the authoritarian boogeyman that the chauvinists claim, nor is the secret power-level hiding commie state that some users here have claimed. The boring truth is that it’s a very risk-averse revisionist socialist state that struck it rich and is dealing with the consequences of that. They have a history of being too gung-ho in their socialism early on and paying dearly for it with many missteps and blunders, so they have overcorrected to be as safe and boring as possible while still being considered socialists.
To be fair, Mao and company sometimes seemed to forget what the point of having a vanguard is and that can be directly connected to several of their greatest failures (Hundred Flowers, Four Pests, Red Guards), rather than being “too socialist,” because left-deviationism isn’t just being “too socialist”.
The general public in China does not care about these theoretical disputes about “left-deviation”. From their perspective, these blunders and tragedies were, in fact, from being “too socialist” which is why they moved away and to the right
Your narration was not “they say this” but “this is so”. Of course revisionists would use Mao’s failures to attack socialism in general, but that doesn’t mean we should uncritically repeat that framing.
No it literally was “they say this”. Reread the comment, I’m describing why China is the way it is (revisionist, right-leaning, averse to risks, averse to internationalism). It’s due to their history of doing the opposite and getting punished for it.
As-written, no it isn’t. If that’s what you meant, sure, I believe you, but as-written your phrasing states directly that they were “too gung-ho in their socialism” and the rest of the comment doesn’t reframe that statement to be “in their minds,” but is posed as a fact that has provoked them to react a certain way.
You are the worst poster on this website. The context of the comment was me criticizing China for being revisionist and non-interventionist! Why would you think then that I agree that they are “too socialist”? Are you really this inept at understanding and parsing information? You just have debate-brain and want to do gotchas with out of context clipping of my comments
That is true.
Were too socialist. You do clearly say that their modern position is an over-correction. You nonetheless did say they were “too socialist.” As-written, you were ceding to their framing of the issue even if you still criticized their response to it.
Idk, maybe you just didn’t express that part of your comment the way you intended. What motivation would I possibly have to be actively deceptive apropos of nothing? That doesn’t make any sense, I don’t have anything against you, despite the name-calling and such that you continue to direct at me.
Everyone pls read Wang Hui
Can also read the China 2020 issue of the Monthly Review
Links pls 🙏
This book is the most immediately topical, but it’s 15 years old, now. Either way all of his writing is pretty damn dense: https://annas-archive.org/md5/f9a82cc453d6e346d4f361549cd5ebba
Here is the MR’s China 2020 issue: https://monthlyreview.org/9980072052020/ (edit: looks like the links might be broken on that page, but you can google the title and it will bring you back to the MR site).
Starting with JBF’s introuction to the issue is a decent start: https://monthlyreview.org/articles/china-2020-an-introduction/
https://monthlyreviewarchives.org/mr/issue/view/900
Archived versions here:
Maybe someone can mirror the pdf too